Veterans of the Yom Kippur War are Heard

0:50 – GS:

Join me for a conversation with Elimelech Kristol.

1:02 – GS:

Okay, we are in a car. I’m with my friend Elimelech Crystal, who is wearing a t-shirt that says LoChmei Kippur, Fighters of Kippur. And the first time I came across that t-shirt was at the demonstrations before October 7th, and a friend of mine pointed out a bunch of guys, probably in their 70s who were on top of a tank, and these were veterans of the Yom Kippur War. And they were protesting for democracy. And we’re going to find out what they did once the war started. But first, let’s say hello to Elimelech.

1:48 – GS:

And thanks for driving us today and participating in the Madlik podcast. How are you, Elimelech?

1:54 – Elimelech Crystal

I’m fine, very fine.

1:56 – EC:

And I’m optimistic.

1:58 – GS:

Okay, so we can stop the podcast right now on that positive note! But why don’t we start from the beginning? Where were you before the war? And by that, I mean the Yom Kippur War. Tell us about what makes you a lochmei Yom Kippur.

2:17 – EC:

I was a commander of a tank, Patton, and a day before the Yom Kippur War, on the 5th of October, I was supposed to go to a vacation release from the army. I had two weeks’ vacation, and then I’m going to a base in the center of Israel. And released from the army. I was based in Rafah, in Rafiach. And I was on the bus to go home. And 12, 12.30, they told us that we cannot go. Something, maybe something is happening and we cannot go home. So we got off the bus and we stay in the base all of us all of the people in the base we had a Shabbat dinner and we had a good mood and we celebrate and then In the morning of Yom Kippur we sensed that something bad is going to come and around 11 o’clock, 12 we understood that something happened on the Suez Canal and I think around one o’clock We got the order to arm the tanks and to go on the wheels (as opposed to transport on flatbed trucks) to the Suez Canal.

4:34 – EC:

We came to the battlefield around Sunday morning. It was quite a mess. Nobody knew what’s going on around. And we understood from friends that we met close to the Suez Canal we understood that many of our soldiers on the front line was killed and that the Egyptian penetrate the Sinai desert in two or three places and they are on the east side of the canal. Our fortification was bombed. And we have around 22 fortifications along the Suez Canal. And we started to understand that some of them were conquered.

6:01 – EC:

Of course, Sunday you heard bombs. We were worried because we didn’t hear airplanes So we understood that something happened to our Air Force that is not around. We didn’t sleep this night we couldn’t sleep and Monday morning we got the order to attack and we were start, you know, driving the tanks towards the canal. And we came to a place close to the Firdan Bridge. We saw the water, we saw the bridge. But all around was full of Egyptian. They were running between our 22 tanks with missiles, with small suitcases that they have rockets there.

7:28 – EC:

And they were shooting and they were hitting the tanks and we you know for the people that grew up on the legend that when the Egyptian hear the noise of the tank coming we will see shoes (because these simple peasant arabs will throw off their army boots and run) and we won’t see any soldier because they will all run away. This was the stories and the legend that we grew up in the armed tank. So, we see people running towards us with the missiles, ammunitions. And unfortunately, about 16 (out of 22) tanks were burning. Our regiment was kept in surprise, completely surprised.

8:34 – EC:

And the tanks were being hit one after the other. At one moment, because I was a half body out of the shell, how do you call it? The turret. In the turret. Yes. So I found myself flying in the air and hearing a bomb. Below me I was like I felt that I’m burning in my face and I found myself on the sand and my tank keep on driving to go towards the Suez Canal a hole in the chest I couldn’t breathe well. My eyes, right eye, I see only blood. And I was burning. All the right side of my face and the shoulder was burned.

9:56 – EC:

And they put me on this tank. We went out of the battlefield. And I found myself in the field hospital. They put a tube in my chest to try to help me to breathe. Took me with an helicopter to the hospital in Refidim. From Refidim they took me by another helicopter to Be’er Sheva, to Soroka. And after two months in three different department in the hospital, I was fixed very well and they released me home. And this is my participation and the remembrance of Yom Kippur. I must admit, when I came back to Jerusalem after releasing from the hospital, I couldn’t understand how life is keeping as usual.

11:19 – EC:

Most of my friends, were killed in this war and I saw that things are you know like nothing happened we were not surprised that we were not a tank that everything is okay. We almost lost the country, but the government is still there.

12:08 – Multiple Speakers

Golda is still there.

12:11 – EC:

In December, the end of December, they made an election and Golda Meir and Dayan won 50 remember 51 seats in the Knesset and they formed a new government and this is when one of …  the only fortification in Suez Canal that didn’t surrender and the commander of this fortification Motti Ashkenazi came to Jerusalem…  I remember in the winter of ‘74 January 74 and he stood alone in front of the Prime Minister building in front of Golda and he demand that Golda and Dayan will resign and I was I was between the first 50-60 people that joined him there and from week to week a movement of the veterans became stronger and on April ‘74 Golda resigned and Dayan resigned and they formed another government.

13:58 – GS:

So, before we get to the parallels between what you just described and today, I want to pause for a second because you also told me that after the war it changed your attitude to life. And I think we would be remiss if we didn’t pick up on that as well. I think you said something to the effect that you decided to be happy every day. Something along those lines…. What did you tell me? How did it change you? You were given a new life?

14:28 – EC:

I was in the hospital and you know all the news from the battlefield are coming very quick and day by day, I heard that this friend was killed, the other friend was killed, when they crossed the canal, the Suez Canal, and get the army, the third army surrendered, these two guys killed. Many many of my friends that were on the front line in Yom Kippur War and when they cross the Suez Canal for the other side and when they were fighting in the Suez, in Suez town were killed.

15:35 – EC:

So I told myself and I thought about the place, the hell that I got off and if I’m saying that 16 tanks were burned, were hit in this battle on Monday, the 8th of October. You multiply this in four, you can understand that not only that the tanks were burned there, also 64…. how much?

16:22 – EC

I’m a lawyer, I don’t know mathematics.

16:26 – EC:

64 soldiers were killed from our regiment in this day. And I asked myself how come that I’m out of this hell and I realized that it’s like somebody gave me a present gave me life back and if I have to live my life I must be optimistic I must be happy I must do the right thing.

I want to mention this to you.You know I have a very good friend from Kibbutz Dovrat; Ephraim Yisraeli and Ephraim Yisraeli and me were very good friends we started the army together bed beside bed for one year in the intensive life of the army for one year we’ve been together and Ephraim was killed when he crossed the Suez Canal with his tank I think it was 21^st  22^nd of October His younger brother that also were in the armed tank were killed as well.

18:10 – EC:

And every Memorial Day, since then, we are a small group of people meeting at the memorial day before the Independence Day of Israel. We’re meeting in the cemetery in Kibbutz Dovrat. And I’m asking myself if the sacrifice of this, if I’m worth that they sacrifice their life for me and for the others if what did we do the last year that we deserve their sacrifice if you understand what I’m trying to say and this is why I was trying to do Good stuff, good things. Always to be, always to live with a half full glass, not the empty glass, and to do the right things.

19:31 – EC:

To me, to my family, but also to the community around.

19:38 – GS

So fast forward.

19:40 – GS:

It’s obvious at this point that you’re an optimist, that you’re a patriot. You’re a successful businessman, a successful real estate lawyer. You took part in protests after the Yom Kippur War. Fast forward 50 years. Let’s go back a few months before the war. And you were part of a movement of veterans who were continuing the same type of protest that occurred after the Yom Kippur War. Tell us who you are, what this group is, what were you protesting for, and then let’s talk about how things have changed since the war on October 7th.

20:25 – EC:

In January, January 22, no, 23, Yariv Levin, the Minister of Justice, came on the TV and he declared a war on the Supreme Court in Israel. And we sense by his speech we sense that we are in danger we are in danger because Netanyahu create a very extreme right government but until you know at the first day we didn’t realize the danger that it could bring but from this day I remember We were shocked. For one week, we were shocked and we understood that something bad is happening. And a week, two weeks later, a group of veterans from Yom Kippur, we got together and we started to think what we should do.

21:54 – EC:

And the fights in the Knesset started, fights in the street started, and we wanted to contribute extra value to the arguments and to the discussions and the fights in the streets. So we are all from the armed tanks. We went and we found in Ramat HaGolan an old tank that was burned in the war and it was thrown away in Golan Heights and we thought that we should take this tank we should put him on a truck We should stretch the independence declaration on this tank and we’ll go to the citizens in Israel, we’ll ask them to be together, to go back for the base where the country was established and when the independence declaration were written and signed by our leaders and to say, to spread the message that if change is needed, then we should make the change by a mutual understanding, wider as it could be, and based on the principle, the three things in the independence declaration.

23:58 – GS:

I would think that based on the fact that you all risked your lives and gave your best friends, your brothers, for this country, that you were hoping that your voice would be heard a little bit louder. We were talking earlier today and I asked you about the future. Where are we going to get our leaders? And you started talking about where we need to look for our leaders, and you said something to the effect that we shouldn’t be looking up, we should be looking around. And I think part of that is amongst the soldiers who are fighting now. Did I hear correctly?

24:36 – EC:

Yes, of course, of course. There are, I believe, I believe the politicians, yeah, our politicians failed us. I believe that it’s not only our Prime Minister. The Prime Minister is the first, and he’s the blame, and he’s doing all the wrongs to turn us into some kind of dictatorship. But he will fail it. He won’t succeed. He didn’t succeed. But it’s not only him. I think also other leaders that became to be professional politicians should go away. And I believe that our leaders now are fighting in the north, fighting in Gaza, and are walking between us.

25:40 – EC:

And we have to look for them and to encourage them to and to push them to the first line and to try to bring them to the that everybody will see them and focus on them and we need to go back to the basics.

26:04 – GS:

So you know that I run a charity and since the war we’ve been overwhelmed by requests for assistance to Israel, support for the soldiers, trauma, the citizens of Israel that have been relocated. But your organization, and I think you, sent me a request that I have to say, of all the requests that we received, I don’t know if the right word is to put a smile on my face, but the request was your group had come together, you’d pivoted right after the war started. And decided how could we serve the soldiers and you came up with the idea of putting showers on the backs of flatbed trucks with heaters, with water, with everything that would possibly be needed to provide showers for the soldiers and bring them to the border so that when the soldiers were given an hour or two or a half day off, they could come and take a warm shower.

27:14 – GS:

And that in and of itself was just a beautiful offer. But what really inspired me was this image of veterans from the last existential war coming, welcoming, supporting soldiers of today’s existential war. And this connection between what you’ve experienced and what they’re experiencing, and of course what you just said now. Your goals, your hopes, and all of our hopes with those soldiers. And today, we went to the border of Gaza. We met with a group of young soldiers, and we took a look at one of those showers.

27:57 – GS:

And I’d love to hear what else you’re doing, but I do believe that I’m sure the irony is not lost on you. And that you understand that when you speak, and your fellow veterans speak, you have a voice that is stronger than any of ours. And when you go and reach out to those young 18-year-olds who are fighting today’s war, I’ve got to believe there’s a special kesher, there’s a special connection between you both, and you probably both give each other strength.

28:36 – EC:

Look. The situation in ‘73 and today was the same the only difference was that we were fighting 200 kilometers away from the borders of Israel…. the Suez Canal and they are fighting inside Israel what happened that they (the Hamas terrorists) conquered kibbutzim, they conquered places, they came to Ashkelon, to Sderot, and to Zikim. It was worse because people really had to fight for their houses. To protect their houses, not in theory. And we saw it today in (Kibbutz) Nirim. We saw it, that the houses, the burning houses and what happening, and we heard live evidence of what happened there.

29:59 – EC:

I think that the solidarity of the civilian community in Israel and the mutual guarantee that we feel towards each other is much, much stronger than any of our enemies can imagine. Although we had this argument, although we were fighting in the street, you know, 130% of the Miluimnikim, of the veterans, went to the war, went and wear a uniform again. And it was after a very bad year that somebody divided us to if you are with me then you are okay if you are against me you are a traitor everybody Everybody in Israel, the citizens.

31:31 – EC:

Take myself for example. It doesn’t matter if I am right or left. If I don’t support Bibi, I am a lefty traitor. This is the sticker that he put on us. And we have to fight it. We have to change it. And we are going to do it and we are we insist to keep on doing it and we are not going home we are not going home if tomorrow will be election we will be in the street if the government will be elected and we will form another government in Israel we are going to sleep with one eye open we are not going away after what happened and I’m sure many others will join us on this because we have to secure the life of our grandkids.

32:38 – EC:

I’m not talking about my kids, I’m talking about grandkids. I want to be sure that they will have the best country in the world. With values, with the base values that our founders created and we grew upon them. Liberty, freedom, justice, If you want to be a religious, you are free to be a religious. If you don’t want to be religious, everything is okay. If you want to be a liberal, democrat, liberal, we’ll accept you. If you want to be religious, we’ll accept you. We have to live together.

33:27 – EC:

We know that we don’t have any other choice. If we will be weak, All the communities of the Jewish people around the world will be weak and we cannot expose ourselves and we cannot expose them to threats.

33:49 – GS:

So I think the story that’s being told is that all of the groups that were part of the protests before the war, whether it’s your group or Achim LeNeshech, whatever they are, they pivoted and stopped demonstrating and went down to help the war effort and support the citizens. But what I’m hearing from you is that it wasn’t a pivot. You didn’t change direction. It’s the same direction. And we’re driving now back from the showers that we saw that you were providing. And we’re going to meet Saturday night at the demonstrations in Kaplan.

34:34 – GS:

It’s not one or the other, it’s the same fight. And the same fight that you were fighting for before the war, you’re fighting for during the war, and will be after the war. The strength is that our people are together. Kol Yisrael Arevim, Ze’la’zeh. Our strength is the optimism that you show. Our strength is the history that you have in your bones. You’ve lived this state. And we have to take all of that and save this country for your grandchildren, as you said. So I look forward to seeing you at Kaplan on Saturday.

35:13 – GS:

I look forward to learning more about what your group is doing. I know it’s not only the showers, you’re doing trauma relief and other efforts to support the soldiers. And together, we’ll make sure that the country is victorious in the truest sense of the word.

35:35 – EC:

Yes, sure. You saw the religious soldier in the place that we now have been. And you saw how they are sticking together, all of them. We’re one people. Yes, one people. One tribe. We should be one tribe. But what Bibi did, he divide us. He divide us. But he will go. He will go away. And we will recover.

36:15 – GS:

Well, thank you again. Thank you for driving us today. Thank you for sharing the country. And thank you for being who you are. Shabbat shalom. All the best.