Jethro and the Druze

The conversation also touched on the importance of honesty and community, with the speakers discussing the need for honesty in transactions and the importance of having a large family and community for support. They highlighted the importance of integrity and influence, drawing on the teachings of Simon Peirce and emphasizing the need to manage the population and make a positive impact on the world. The meeting concluded with a call for further action to support the Druze community and a reflection on the lessons to be learned from the historical and contemporary relationship between Jews and Druze, including the need to respect and support minority communities in the country.

Geoffrey Stern: Well, welcome Rabbi Adam from Dubai, and welcome Sheikh Muhana from the border of Israel. Are you on the border with Lebanon or with Syria?

Muhana Fares: Beside the border of Lebanon.

GS: You live in a town called Hurfeish?

MF: Yes, I live in a small village. Village, the Upper Galilee in the North of Israel.

GS: Wonderful. So I just want to make sure everybody knows who you are. As I said, you are at the Ministry of Education and you promote mathematics and science in schools around Israel. I read a story about a school, a Druze school, that was at the bottom of the rankings of all schools in Israel for graduations for Bagrut, and you worked with them not by only putting in the best students. Actually, you took students who had even dropped out, and using your methods and your dedication, you made that school one of the highest-ranking schools in Israel.

So, I am so happy that you are in the Ministry of Education looking out for all our students in Israel and making sure that every student in Israel has the opportunity to advance, to contribute to the world and to compete. I guess you’ve taught in school and once you’re a teacher, you’re always a teacher but you’re doing wonderful things today. Thank you for that.

MF: Thank you. Now I deal with STEM education, math and technology, to the whole student in Israel, not especially in the Jewish sector. And we deal with the whole Israel, in the Territory, in the South, in the North, and we increase, we doubled the number of pupils that learn five points of math in Israel last five years.

Adam Mintz: That’s amazing, wow.

GS: When I was researching the Druze for this conversation, I came across a quote from President Shimon Peres, and he was talking about the Druze, and we all know in this week’s parasha, We have the only parasha in the Torah that is named after someone who’s not Jewish, and it is Yitro. And what Yitro does is he gives Moses’ advice. He sees that Moses is spending the day from the morning till night judging every single case. And so, Shimon Peres says that Yitro started the first faculty for management and his first student was Moses. I thought that was an amazing quote to keep in mind as we’re talking to someone like you, Muhannad, who is truly taking advantage. In your bio, I see you went to the Mandel School of Educational Leadership. You are a mamlitz; a guide and someone who is helping the people in the state of Israel to help themselves in the path, in the shadow, in the dugma (image) of Yitro. Yitro is a very important person or prophet in the Druze religion, is he not?

5:13 MF Yes, Yitro is the most important prophet in the Druze faith. And you know in Israel, beside Tiberius, a big place, that Yitro lived there, and every year at 25th of April, Jews go to this place to pray, to pray to Yitro. Yitro is a person that was the big prophet in the whole Jews community, not just in Israel, in the whole world, in the whole in the Middle East.

AM: Now, why that date?

MF:  Oh, this date, because we established the new building before, I think, 140 years. The day we established the new building was on 25th of April.

AM: Oh, wow.

GS: The building over the grave of Yitro was created on the 25th of April. And do the Druze use a solar calendar or a lunar calendar?

MF: The Druze use both, the Hijri calendar and the Gregorian calendar.

GS: So they are like the Druze, they have a leap year to make sure that the two calendars stay synchronized?

MF: No, we DON’T have special calendars. We use both calendars.

7:12 AM: So, some of the holidays, I think what you’re saying is that some of the holidays are based on the solar calendar and some of the holidays are based on the lunar calendar.

MF: Yes, right,

GS: okay, good, I got it.

So I was preparing for today and I never, I always had focused on the fact that Yitro gave such good advice and that he had his own parasha. But what I had never realized until I studied this year was how much love and respect there was for Yitro. In one of the midrashim, it says that there are seven names that Yitro has. And, of course, the word Yeter is like Yoter. So it is Yeter is abundant. Chovav, he was loved. Ruel, he was a friend to the Lord. And, of course, Ruel is very similar to Re’Acha.

Discussion on the Similarities Between Yitro and Abraham in Different Traditions

8:20 GS: And we’ll see shortly, that comes up too. Hever, he was a companion. Petuel, he weaned himself from idolatry. He’s in many of the Jewish midrashim, he’s very similar to the way we look at Abraham. We’ll see that he, in our tradition, he studied all the religions of the world, all the idols of the world, and he rejected them. And then Keni, he was a kinai, he was zealous. And then, of course, I believe in Arabic, his name is Shuayb. Is that how you pronounce it?

MF: In Arabic, is Shuayb, and sha in Arabic, is nation. Ayd is The father of nations.

GS: So is he. Is he looked at very much like Abraham for the Jews, in terms of these common traditions that we have that he was a priest of Median, that he rebelled against all of the existing religions and he discovered God on his own. Is that similar to the tradition that you have?

MF: I didn’t understand.

9:46 GS: Your question. When I looked also in the Koran even when it talks about Jethro, it makes him very similar to our tradition about a Rahama Vinu. That Avraham Avinu. That Avraham Avinu discovered God all on his own, and he threw down the idols, the Avodah Zarah of his time. And in both the Koran and in the Jewish sources, it’s very similar. There’s a midrash that says that he tried all the other religions. It says that he left no idol un worshipped. So Lohna of Voda Salo ad. And then he came to the one God.

And I’m just wondering whether within the Druze tradition, it’s the same type of understanding of what made Yitro so special.

MF: Yes, you know, in the Quran, we can see Shoaib Yitro in 11 places. And like you say, Yitro came to the Midian and asked them to praise God, and they canceled him. And he try and try and try. And you know the Midian people were not Yashar.

GS: They weren’t honest they weren’t straight.

MF: (in Hebrew) you know they were merchants and they had two sets of weights, one to sell and one to buy and they always took a lot and gave less.

Importance of Honesty and Community

GS: Hello, So they had, they had two sets of weights and they would use the weights to favor themselves. When they sold, they would use one weight, and when they bought, they used another weight. They weren’t straight, as you said. They weren’t yashar.

MF: Yes. The Yishua’id asked him to be honest, and they wouldn’t agree. And I can see, if we speak about the Parsha. You know if you have a small family, we can kill you. But you have a big family. What we learn from this surah, that It’s not enough to be Tzodek; right. You must be with a lot of people beside you, to keep the honest, and to be good.

GS: It’s very important who your community is.

13:13 MF: Yes. So, Shu’ayb, tell him that they didn’t kill Shu’ayb because Shu’ayb was… He ran with a big community, big family.

AM: What you’re saying is that it’ not enough to be correct but you have to actually influence the world. You have to make an impact on the world. Geoffrey, that’s a very interesting idea, right? I mean, we all want to be right, but who cares if we’re right, if nobody cares? But what you’re saying is that we have to be right, and we have to make an impact on the world at the same time.

MF: As Simon Peirce said, Yitro teaches others how to manage the population. Yes. I think that what Yitro taught Moshe is also written in the founding documents of America, in the Declaration of America.

AM: I’m not familiar with that, but you’re saying is that the advice that Yitro gave to Moshe is actually found in the Declaration of Independence. We know, Geoffrey, that on the Liberty Bell is a verse from the book of Vayikra, and you shall proclaim liberty throughout the land. I’m not sure that in the Declaration of Independence it says the advice that Moshe gave to, that Yitro gave to Moshe. But I’ll just, I just want to take off on that idea since we’re talking about Yitro and the advice that Moshe, that Yitro gave to Moshe.

It’s very interesting, you know, Moses, when he meets God at the burning bush, at the snack, so Moses looks at himself as being someone who’s very unworthy. He’s very humble. He’s a nav. And then when Yitro looks at him, Moshe seems to be almost arrogant to say, I can handle all of these legal cases on my own. I don’t need any help by anybody else. And what Yitro reminds him of is that you need to be humble. If you’re going to be a leader, you need to be humble. And one of the things that humility gives us is the ability to recognize that you need help from other people.

And I think that’s a very important lesson. And it’s that lesson that allows Moses to receive the Ten Commandments, yes, as he grows from God. Because Moshe, he goes back to being humble. And only a humble person can receive the Ten Commandments from God. So I think that’s really, that might be what you’re talking about, is that that’s really the lesson that Yitro teaches to Moshe.

16:46 GS:        You know, there’s another part of the Torah that talks about Yitro. In B’midbar, in Numbers, Moshe is asking Yitro to come with the Jewish people, with the Israelites, into the land of the promised land. And Yitro says, Vayoma elav lo eylech ki im el artsi ve el molareti eylech. And even though there are some traditions, some rabbinic traditions that Yitro converted, I think it’s easier and more straightforward to say that he was a tzaddik (Hasidei) umot haolam, and he wanted to go back to his people.

And then he goes on to say, ahavta et ha-ger. So it seems to me this is the chidush that I had this year. That not only is Yitro called Re-Acha, not only is he called our friend, but it could very well be that one interpretation of the Ahavta le-Re-Acha Kamocha and the Ahavtem et Hager relates to the unique relationship between the Jewish people, the Israelites, and the children of Yitro, the Ke’enim. Is there a unique relationship between our two peoples?

Discussion on the Relationship Between Jews and Druze in Israel

MF:  You know, the relationship between Jews and the Druze people, it’s before 1948. I think especially because the connection between Yitro and Am Yisrael, and another, it goes Jews are minority, and the Jews came to Israel as a minority. So they together became brothers, and became the state. And still now we know Jews serve in the army, like Jews.

I think that the connection between Jitro and Moshe and the statement that but Jews and Druze are minorities in the Middle East.

GS:  I think that’s fascinating. You know, Rabbi Adam, he does something that many Jews have never done in the past. He does conversions. And one of the other things that Jews and Druze have in the past is we don’t go out and try to convert other people because we are a minority and we don’t want to be a threat. We don’t talk about our religion in the sense of trying to convince other people to follow our religion. Again, as you say, because we’re minorities, we’ve developed certain, I think, mechanisms to protect ourselves against persecution.

So I think you’re absolutely right. There are many things that we Jews have in common with Druze, and much of that comes from the fact that we have been a historically persecuted minority.

AM:  Yeah, that point is really a very important point. Thank you so much for raising that point. And the connection between the Jews and the Druze is really something I think people, you know, Jeffrey, there’s not enough written about the relationship between the Jews and the Druze. And I think that’s really something that, you know, we would all gain a lot by, you know, by knowing more about that connection.

GS:  Well and I think one thing and now I’m going to leave the Torah and the ancient texts and talk about today. I think that one of the reasons that the Druze are held in such high regard in Israel is is because they also have, as a minority, they’ve developed a mechanism of being very loyal to the country that they live in. In the Talmud, we have an expression, Dinei de Malchuta, that you follow the rules of the land that you are in. And it was very important for the Jews as a minority to publish that, to say that we don’t want to be different.

We want to obey the rules. But the Jews, as a result, have always fought in the IDF. But to say that they’ve also fought in the IDF would not be accurate. They have excelled. They have, just like many times in societies, The Jews are only 2% in American population, but we are very well represented in Israel, even though the Druze, I think, are also only about 2%. When you look at those soldiers who are leading the way, Those soldiers, unfortunately, who are wounded and killed in battle, the Druze are represented way beyond the 2% of the population that they are.

Am I correct?

MF:  Yes, you know, the principle Dinei de Malkuta Dina, we use it everywhere. I think all the Druze in Lebanon are very loyal to Lebanon. The Druze in Syria must be loyal to the Syrians. And in Israel also, yes, not just in the army, also in the civil field, you can meet a lot of managers, Druze managers. You are correct you find Druze in every field, not just in the army, also in the government. A lot of Jews work there in the high level of position.

GS:  We’re coming to the end, and it has been an absolute privilege and pleasure to talk with you. But I’d like to ask you what needs to be done further? I know that five years ago there was a very controversial law called the Nation State Law, and I really believe that the Druze were our enayim. They helped us see the rule and understand unintended consequences and they brought protests that many Israeli generals, current and past, were on their side. That they help Israel define who it is in a better way.

But what needs to be done more for the Druze? Because they are still a minority and they need, you are a perfect example of someone who is serving the whole state in a management position in education. But I think, obviously, there’s more that when we help the Druze, we help ourselves. We become all better for it. What is your vision, and what are your concerns for the Druze in Israel today? Okay,

MF:  I will speak it in Hebrew.

AM:  We’ll translate….

27:13 MF:        The nation state law that was legislated in Israel was a slap in the face of the Druze of Israel. It says that Druze have all the obligations, but they don’t have all the rights, as though they are not Israelis. And you see all the military conscription of the Jews now for everywhere in Israel. And they come home. They have no protection. There are issues of planning and protection and the fear that this law and other laws to follow will affect on the quality of the life of the Jews in Israel.

It’s a very harsh law, very racist. And there is not a single Druze who will accept the law. And therefore, in my opinion, after the war, the state of Israel, any government, has to draft legislation and correct this law, either to erase the law or change it, so that the Israeli Druze will continue to feel proud in their country.

AM:  Wow. So what you’re saying is that you hope that after the war that the law will be revoked and that the Druze can be proud members of Israeli society.

GS:  Yes, and I think you know a after reading what we read in the Parshah in terms of how, and I didn’t even mention when Moshe came out to meet with Yitro, he bowed down and the Midrash says that the Shechinah was there. I think when you take the Kavod that we’ve had for Yitro and the Kinim through the ages, when Shaykh Mohanna says that this rule was a slap in the face, that was the words that he used, of the Druzim, we have to take that very seriously. And the only thing I would add to what you said, Shaykh Mohanna, is it’s not only a slap in your face, it’s a slap in the face of every citizen of Israel because we have to be one together and if we can’t respect or if we learn anything from the history of the Jews and the history of the Jews, It is that if you can’t respect the minority, then you can’t respect the majority.

If you can’t see the world through the eyes of the minority, then you’ve lost your way and you’re in darkness. So, I just want to finish by thanking you further, Muhanna, about things that we can do together, but I thank you so much for participating in today’s discussion. Todah rabah v’shabbat shalom.

AM: Thank you so much, Sheikh Mohanna. Thank you so much for participating. Shabbat Shalom. Jeffrey, Shabbat Shalom, and thank you for organizing this. This is really important.

MF:  Thank you so much. Shabbat Shalom.